EQ vs Tone

picture_of_nectar · January 15, 2012, 10:10:55 PM

Quote
Remember the super shitty rig I had? I became a born again guitarist and put it all on eBay. I stared with a great amp, then guitar. Only now am I slowly adding one strategic pedal at a time. Yummy!

Think about it.

I remember recommending you ditch the sustainer pedal crap and getting a nice hollowbody and good tube amp!

And that you did!

A good rig sort of makes pedals a moot point.

Brian27 · January 21, 2012, 08:01:42 PM

After much consideration i have decided to get a Boss SD-1 as a clean Boost and The Cmatmods Signa Drive for main overdrive. I love the 3 way toggle switch and the ability to choose anything from Clean Boost all the way up to Marshall crunch and anywhere in between. As far as Tube amps go when Income taxes get here im getting a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe. Thanks for the advise and the criticisms as well.

Poster · January 22, 2012, 10:33:38 AM

That hot rod sucks. Even after you mod the shit out of it. You can swap speakers, but your much better off, getting something else. How much are you looking to spend? You should be looking used.

fulltone1989 · January 22, 2012, 10:46:36 AM

Hot Rods are fine for the money, if they suck then why are they the highest-selling tube amp?

Poster · January 22, 2012, 10:54:04 AM

I would argue there are plenty alternatives! ive owned 2 of them (had at the same time), modded the hell out of 1. My old guitar player still uses the torress modded one. I can attest to them being pretty reliable for a pcb amp, but something about the master volume, the way the enclosure is constructed, something about it made it my least favorite for fender cleans. And I think I spent enough time and money chasing it with that amp to share my opinion. Those things suck, I dont give a shit how many of them have sold. Most people dont have good tone.

I think any newer combo amp is constructed poorly. You can stick whatever speakers you want in that piece of shit, and its just going to be close to a really cheap open back cabinet. Just go get a chinese open back 2x12, load it with deville speakers and plug in. I prefer the opposite, separate enclosures for heads and cabs, with really heavy construction. I didnt used to feel that way, until my amp builder checked me, but he was really weird about the cabinets/head philosophy, and ever since I got into really matching speaker compliments with different heads.

Happyorange27 · January 22, 2012, 10:57:09 AM

And that's why I like your posts. You actually have experience to back it up. Nice. I love my amp but by the time you spend all the mod money, I could have just bought a vintage fender.

IamWILSON · January 22, 2012, 11:01:44 AM

I'm gonna have to agree with Poster here! I used to own a Fender Hot Rod DeVille. It was the first tube amp I owned. And I spent about 8 or 9 years trying to find a tone I liked! Never was happy with it. Since then I've owned an Egnater Rebel 20, Blues Jr - Humboldt, and Mesa Boogie MkIII, all of which I've been much happier about my tone. And believe it or not got each of them for cheaper or the same price than you'll pay for a new Hot Rod Deluxe!

And Happy O is very correct about getting a vintage fender, which if you bought and didn't like, you can sell and get all your money back quickly!

Poster · January 22, 2012, 11:10:41 AM

What lots of you kids like to forget when tinkering around, is that big red is ripping through a million bucks in front of house on any given night. If you like some of those Huge tonal avenues he explores at some enormous show, you have to really decide what you want to do, how often you need to do it, etc. A guy like steve kimock sets his own shit up every night. That was Jerry Garcias favorite guitar player... Anyway, hes got some creative means to an end tonally. Ive tried to mesh a little bit of Kimock, Red, Knopf, and Even Petes rigs to get my tone where I like it live in these bars/clubs.

My big pet peeves are always

-will it work everytime
-does it make sense why it sounds the way it does
-how many bases can I cover
-can i make my cleans as loud as triple throwdown distortion
-can i do every sound i need without looking down and interrupting my train of thought

I cant always do all of those things, but thats what Iam shooting for on any given gig, with any little rig I put together, as each gig will not work with the same gear. Sorry, thats just reality. Pods, emulation, solid state computer douche, all that shit just plain sucks.

manicstarseed · January 22, 2012, 12:55:14 PM

These last two posts, by Poster and Wilson make great sense. I think The Blues Jr is a better tone for $$ proposition than the Hot Rod Deluxes, hell until I modded my Nomad, the Jr had me sick with tone envy. Its why I got my Express, smaller, lighter, killer cleans, smooth creamy distortion, It goes on. Lets just say I like Mesa's features. I modded the Nomad and its like I have a Fender-Mesa. Thick/Creamy/Chimey cleans with the Mesa drive to boot.

A quick search shows that you can get a MkIII for like $900, that's $200 more for a killer amp that blows away the HRs.

One think I have to keep in mind is that I constantly have to take OD/Distortion discussions with a grain of salt. I love my amps and while I have a complement of effects, I rarely use pedals because the OD/Distortion/Compression/ --- TONE of my amps/guitars are so good and versatile. I use pedals for a specific effect or sound.

Really ... start with an amp that has killer tone and the rest is easy.

manicstarseed · January 22, 2012, 12:59:06 PM

Quote from: Poster on January 22, 2012, 11:10:41 AM
....Ive tried to mesh a little bit of Kimock, Red, Knopf, and Even Petes rigs to get my tone where I like it live in these bars/clubs.
.....

Help me with the influence...
I know Kimock, Red=Trey, Knopf=Mark....

Pete? Pete Who?

Brian27 · January 22, 2012, 01:52:59 PM

A used Tube amp is the only kind of Tube amp i am getting. What about a Fender Super Sonic 22? Those things look badass and have just the right amount of Distortion

Happyorange27 · January 22, 2012, 01:53:13 PM

Quote from: manicstarseed on January 22, 2012, 12:55:14 PM
Really ... start with an amp that has killer tone and the rest is easy.

This is so true. A simple, yet profound statement. Hell I know my amp is just a stepping stone in my journey.

fulltone1989 · January 22, 2012, 02:32:59 PM

Quote from: Brian27 on January 22, 2012, 01:52:59 PM
A used Tube amp is the only kind of Tube amp i am getting. What about a Fender Super Sonic 22? Those things look badass and have just the right amount of Distortion

Although better than a HRD (I've owned both) I found that the construction wasn't anything to write home about, and many, many people have complained about the reverb and other reliability issues. Why not check out a silverface amp? Seems like a Twin would be in your price range judging what amps you suggested. What are you looking for in the amp? FX Loop? OD Channel?

Brian27 · January 22, 2012, 02:47:00 PM

A silverface Twin would have 3 band EQ on both Channels right? Im not looking for a Amp with no mid EQ on both channels

fulltone1989 · January 22, 2012, 02:56:43 PM

Quote from: Brian27 on January 22, 2012, 02:47:00 PM
A silverface Twin would have 3 band EQ on both Channels right? Im not looking for a Amp with no mid EQ on both channels

I believe it does, my 65RI twin had them on both. However, the Twins are crazy loud and heavy but you get a US made, hand-wired amp with 2x12 speakers. No OD channel though.

They made a Supersonic Twin that has a mid knob.