More History of Languedoc

[rmolsonguitars]

I just joined SD a few weeks ago and hadn't posted yet, but this one brought me out. I checked your site out just because I was curious, and can't believe you can actually straight up lie with a straight face. Seriously, how do you sleep at night?

"Our Ollandoc Model is Similar to the Old 1975 Starcaster Body Style Languedoc France Style Guitar Copy Clone Replica."

Just admit that you are trying to steal Paul's design, get the headstock to match as close as possible without getting sued, and then sell cheap POS guitars to people who don't know any better because they want to pretend to be Trey.

You should pretty much just stop posting, because you only embarrass yourself more.

Was talking to one of your forum members today and he told me he had read an interview where Paul admitted that the Starcaster was his inspiration and just reduced the body size. That was back when he worked for Time... I think they may have wanted to keep the body shape as theirs. I know they named one of their guitars a Timecaster. 

[Poster]

This guy said this about that - fucking judge joe brown in here

[Heady Jam Fan]

The site moderators just need to remove him from the forum for attempting to sell fakes, and lets just move on. Just be glad we responded so he doesn't screw anyone on this site. His login should have been removed after the first post.

I just got a sale today from a forum member.  He has been watching what I been doing for a long time on another forum. Thanks

And I just got this email...

Hey Robert,


Just got the guitar today. Couldn't be more satisfied with my purchase. It is an absolutely beautiful instrument and plays and sounds like a dream. The Seymour Duncan's are amazing. I was expecting something good given the price tag, however this has somehow managed to exceed my already high expectations.


I foresee this guitar being my main axe for the rest of my life, I honestly cannot picture anything short of a real doc that I would prefer over this. Sounds just as good if not better than my friends $6,500 hollowbody PRS!


I have it running through a digitech whammy > 2x tube screamers > Ross compressor clone > fender super champ tube amp. And it sounds nearly identical to Trey's mid nineties tone.


Before this I had been playing one of the Phred Instruments docs, and I cannot stress enough how much better in every aspect your ollandoc is compared to a phred.


I am completely blown away and am just ecstatic right now. Just wanted to express my appreciation and gratitude and thank you so very much for crafting such a beautiful high end yet very reasonably priced languedoc clone.


Thanks again,
Bryan

My dog eats shit. Don't mean its any good.

Wait till his Ollancoc starts to fall apart.
He is just convincing himself its good after dropping dime - he will try the PRS again and realize he got ripped the f off.
I thought you weren't 'copying' Languedoc's anymore - why are you still comparing the two?

[express50express]

Thats it, i am buying one!

[Heady Jam Fan]

Was talking to one of your forum members today and he told me he had read an interview where Paul admitted that the Starcaster was his inspiration and just reduced the body size. That was back when he worked for Time... I think they may have wanted to keep the body shape as theirs. I know they named one of their guitars a Timecaster. 

Go back to my first post where I stated this is "common knowledge."

Paul's Languedoc is miles from a Starcaster NOW (not sure about Time Co and thats outside of this argument):
1) Aesthetic Design:
- Contoured top (which you copied)
- Nicer Headstock (which you copied)
- Nicer shaped Horns (which you copied)
- Nicer Inlays (which you copied)
2) Construction: I don't know all the advancements in construction over a Starcaster, but some...
- Huge improvement from the bolt-on neck (which you copied)
- Bent sides (which you aren't skilled enough to do)
- Much improved bridge/tailpiece (which you tried to copy)
- Electronics (which you copied, even including where the knobs and switches are laid out, but apparently you can't even solder well, so your having the harness made for you)
- Fully (rather than semi) Hollow (which you copied)
3) Quality:
- I've never seen someone trying to cop Trey tones with a Startcaster. This is clear evidence that the 'Doc (style), in the opinion of Phish fans, adds a distinct quality over the original design. Any hollowbody with a similar construction to a 'Doc will be more similar to a 'Doc in tonal qualities than a Starcaster. This includes Gibsons, PRS, Artinger... not your POS.
4) Market:
Considering all these improvements over a Starcaster, as well as the price difference, and that Phish fans don't buy Starcasters, Paul is not stealing from Fender's market. His is totally distinct. (The fact that you won't give up on this thread evidences your attempt to steal Paul's market).
5) Mother f'in honesty:
PAUL ADMITS HIS INSPIRATION. HE WAS NEVER THREATENED WITH LEGAL ACTION BY FENDER BECAUSE HE HAS DONE NOTHING WRONG.
Paul deserves respect, you deserve a desert island (and you only get to take your own guitar with you).

[Poster]

RM OLSON GUITARS really doesnt have alot of info about them online? I wonder if most people know they are even made in China? Or do they get the impression that they are made in Arkansas? Interesting.

[No Nice Guy]

On a note of not bashing RMO, I did a bit of research into copyright.  So as far as guitar bodyshapes/headstocks go, it looks like it would be a patent system.  Fender and Gibson patented all of their models, and that's why they won the "lawsuit era" lawsuits - their patents hadn't expired.  If PL has patented the G2 shape, RMO, Phred, even possibly Equator and other luthiers could all be slapped with patent infringement cases.  However, if he's chosen to not, it's open season. 

I have no legal experience whatsoever besides a intro-level law class last semester, this information is all from some heavy Googling/Wikipedia-ing.  Take it with a grain of salt, it might even be wrong.

[rmolsonguitars]

On a note of not bashing RMO, I did a bit of research into copyright.  So as far as guitar bodyshapes/headstocks go, it looks like it would be a patent system.  Fender and Gibson patented all of their models, and that's why they won the "lawsuit era" lawsuits - their patents hadn't expired.  If PL has patented the G2 shape, RMO, Phred, even possibly Equator and other luthiers could all be slapped with patent infringement cases.  However, if he's chosen to not, it's open season. 

I have no legal experience whatsoever besides a intro-level law class last semester, this information is all from some heavy Googling/Wikipedia-ing.  Take it with a grain of salt, it might even be wrong.

It is a Trademark that Paul has not a Patent. It only covers one particular headstock. You can Google Trademarks and find it. 

All "six inline" head stocks are pretty much 50% the same on the tuner side. So who copied who on that?  When you consider the opposite side of the headstock, there are hundreds of different designs.  Can anyone  point out the all differences in theses two pictured below? Paul's lawyer can.  In no way does mine look like the state of VT and I could apply for a Trademark of my own because they are so different.



Here are some of the other differences I had to point out the the Lang lawyer.

In the pic below, you can see that that the horns on the Lang are somewhat rounded. Mine come to points and are not like either the Lang or Starcaster. By the way, I don't think Paul was wrong for modifing a Fender product.  And I am not stealing from Paul's market. His market is rather small compared to all the people who cannot afford a guitar in that price range. Fact is that Paul will only make guitars for a handful of Phish fans... those with money.

In the pic below, I also pointed out that my body shape was closer to the Starcaster.  Also my construction is different.  Right now, I won't offer the bent sides because it would push the price to high. I have Phish fans that have asked me to build with laminates like a Gibson LP hollow body but I don't want them made out of laminates. Right now we start with a two piece mahogany body routed to full hollow with a maple cap. Maybe I could try the spruce cap but no one has asked for it.  I do listen to the wants of my customers so I welcome your ideas.  Best if you just email me though because you will just be put down if you voice yourself here. Well, I guess that's a known fact....

[Poster]

Run-on sentences! Its a conspiracy!


Actually looking at ex. A further, and I can see it clearly now! You actually knocked off Equator who knocked of Languedoc, so yeah your totally the bottom bootie here.

See your real big problem is that Ive owned all those fucking guitars. In fact, Ive owned Phred instruments old version, one of the first equators, 2 of yours (one junk early version, one second hand by accident as the headstock was stripped, and it was unfinished), fingered the shit out of a couple docs... Just sayin' man, you kinda picked the most pretentious board on the web to come ramble off your bullshit. Your chinese guitars suck. Looking at just the ones I saw, basically, its just not a good guitar to try to build that way. It takes real luthier to do an archtop justice. If you argue with that than you really are insane. I understand you want to defend your brand, and I'm just stating the obvious, that any budget minded take on a Languedoc is going to be junk. All those wooden components, the internal bracing your not doing, etc etc etc. That takes ALOT of time, time you cannot afford at your price point. You also don't build any hollowbody guitars by hand, so it would be easy not to understand what I'm trying to tell you. But from my experience, there is alot of work that goes into one of those types of guitars. Much more than with a solid body guitar you can make in your garage.

[rmolsonguitars]

Run-on sentences! Its a conspiracy!


Actually looking at ex. A further, and I can see it clearly now! You actually knocked off Equator who knocked of Languedoc, so yeah your totally the bottom bootie here.

See your real big problem is that Ive owned all those fucking guitars. In fact, Ive owned Phred instruments old version, one of the first equators, 2 of yours (one junk early version, one second hand by accident as the headstock was stripped, and it was unfinished), fingered the shit out of a couple docs... Just sayin' man, you kinda picked the most pretentious board on the web to come ramble off your bullshit. Your chinese guitars suck. Looking at just the ones I saw, basically, its just not a good guitar to try to build that way. It takes real luthier to do an archtop justice. If you argue with that than you really are insane. I understand you want to defend your brand, and I'm just stating the obvious, that any budget minded take on a Languedoc is going to be junk. All those wooden components, the internal bracing your not doing, etc etc etc. That takes ALOT of time, time you cannot afford at your price point. You also don't build any hollowbody guitars by hand, so it would be easy not to understand what I'm trying to tell you. But from my experience, there is alot of work that goes into one of those types of guitars. Much more than with a solid body guitar you can make in your garage.

Lang copied Starcaster... Equator copied and I copied Equator.  And like I said,  I just built it as a proto type for a guy who wanted to sell that guitar model. Originally, I didn't know who Equator or Languedoc was.  That guy gave me some new drawing with some some new changes.

It doesn't mean anything that you have owned all those guitars.  You have an opinion about things and that's okay.  Thing is, opinions are like rectums.... everyone has got one. Doesn't mean your opinion is right except to you.  I have thousands of customers over the last five years and they don't think like you.  Again, here is a quote from an email only a couple days old concerning his Ollandoc... and like usual for you... you can put him down too.  He is also a member here and described you and your bodies as and I quote, "typical internet tough guy phish fans". Another forum member described you using your choice of language which fit you real well.

Here is that last thanks you email I received:

Just got the guitar today. Couldn't be more satisfied with my purchase. It is an absolutely beautiful instrument and plays and sounds like a dream. The Seymour Duncan's are amazing. I was expecting something good given the price tag, however this has somehow managed to exceed my already high expectations.


I foresee this guitar being my main axe for the rest of my life, I honestly cannot picture anything short of a real doc that I would prefer over this. Sounds just as good if not better than my friends $6,500 hollowbody PRS!


I have it running through a digitech whammy > 2x tube screamers > Ross compressor clone > fender super champ tube amp. And it sounds nearly identical to Trey's mid nineties tone.


Before this I had been playing one of the Phred Instruments docs, and I cannot stress enough how much better in every aspect your ollandoc is compared to a phred.


I am completely blown away and am just ecstatic right now. Just wanted to express my appreciation and gratitude and thank you so very much for crafting such a beautiful high end yet very reasonably priced languedoc clone.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I did sell a kit one time that had some loose binding (that was a unfinished guitar kit... not a finished model) and I disclosed that fact. You are probably the guy who bought it and just wasn't talented enough to build the kit.  Any guitar that did not have my logo was a guitar kit.

I will soon post pics of all the beautiful guitars people have built from my kits. 

And, as you say, I guess you are bottom bootie under Heady Jan Fan!

[Happyorange27]

R M is working on a Karma rating only to be topped by the great Posternutbag!

[Heady Jam Fan]

Olson - again I need to ask: what is your goal at this point?
Originally your goal seemed to be to get our approval of your frankly deluded justifications.
Now it seems your trying to sell your products to a group of people who overtly think your a dick bag.

I'm not religious, but I remember a rabbi once said: "insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result."
You keep spewing bullshit and expecting us to react differently.
At first, I hoped you would take the respectable path and stop spouting your rationalizations.
Now I hope this thread reaches anyone considering buying one of your guitars and costs you the sale.
There are much better options from respectable companies.

I just had the opportunity to try one of your 2013 builds. It was the first owner who said he bought it directly from you and it had the logo, so by your own account, that would be a complete (rather than kit) model. The owner of the guitar is a teenager who started playing guitar about two years ago. Since then, he had saved his money from working full-time for two summers at an old-folks home. When he got the guitar, he was ecstatic and wrote you an email apparently pretty similar to the one you already posted twice in this thread: he said his email stated he loved the guitar, it was the best he'd tried and couldn't imagine anything better. He'd only played a Fernandez with a broken neck that someone fixed with wood-glue, plugged into a 25w Fender Frontman - it was the best guitar he'd played. However, he started having problems with his RiM-jibber Olson guitar and he could tell the guys at the guitar shop were not impressed by the craftsmanship - apparently it took two weeks and $100 out of this kids pocket to get it into 'playable' condition. He said he tried out a few more guitars at the music shop and his gut sank - he felt really ripped off and thats when he called me, to get the opinion of another Phish fan guitar player. I let him try my Artinger and he was completely blown away. When I tried the Ollandic, the guitar sounded completely dead - no resonance or liveliness. The neck was completely wonky - twisted so at the nut the high-e string was half a centimeter lower than the low-e string. The intonation was, not surprisingly given the neck, way off - I adjusted the intonation at the bridge and it improved somewhat. Also, the bridge was not grounded - if it ever had been, the soldering hadn't held up the past couple months (I tested the grounding with a multimeter from the bridge to the jack), so the guitar buzzed quite a bit with any dirt pedals. The pickups were also way out of position - one was too low, the other too high and I have to imagine a set of SD 59's would have been an improvement. And visually, the craftsmanship is just not there - the neck joint was messy with bubbles from the glue and/or finish, the fretwork was sloppy and I had to file a handful of them for this kid, the binding was uneven along the edge of the body sticking up past the wood, I could spot dust in the finish in several places.

The kid wanted a working-musicians guitar and figured it would be cool to have one that also looked like Trey's. Now he wasted two summers' earnings on a POS toy that is actually unplayable IMO: he's gone back to his Fernandez with a broken neck for the last three weeks. He feels pretty embarrassed and angry and asked me not to disclose any other personal details about him or the specifics of his guitar (such as the type of wood or when exactly he placed the order) - he doesn't want to think about it anymore. I told him if he helped me sell some of my stuff on Craigslist, he could keep some of the cash and I'd help him get a better guitar (he's interested in something like and SG), or I'd at least help him replace the neck on his Fernandez. He won't sell his Olson guitar because he doesn't think it would be morally right.

Olson, your not providing a service to these people, your ripping people off who don't know any better. The guitars I built in my parent's basement right after college free-handing with a jigsaw and router (the only two powered tools I had) played better - I sold one of them for the cost of parts ($140) and thought that was a fair price. I'd rather have a Cort, Rondo, Washburn or any of those other few-hundred-$ hollowbody guitars than the Olson - much more bang for buck because they actually play and your not just paying for a cheap look-alike built by a guy who is clearly being untruthful to himself and others.

[Happyorange27]

I own an Olson guitar and I fucking love it!!!

Andrew Olson that is. 😎 God I feel bad for AO since these last names might confuse folks searching for reviews on guitars. Not to mention there is a third website for a completely different luthier called olsonguitars. Oh the fuckery.

[rmolsonguitars]

Olson - again I need to ask: what is your goal at this point?
Originally your goal seemed to be to get our approval of your frankly deluded justifications.
Now it seems your trying to sell your products to a group of people who overtly think your a dick bag.

I'm not religious, but I remember a rabbi once said: "insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result."
You keep spewing bullshit and expecting us to react differently.
At first, I hoped you would take the respectable path and stop spouting your rationalizations.
Now I hope this thread reaches anyone considering buying one of your guitars and costs you the sale.
There are much better options from respectable companies.

I just had the opportunity to try one of your 2013 builds. It was the first owner who said he bought it directly from you and it had the logo, so by your own account, that would be a complete (rather than kit) model. The owner of the guitar is a teenager who started playing guitar about two years ago. Since then, he had saved his money from working full-time for two summers at an old-folks home. When he got the guitar, he was ecstatic and wrote you an email apparently pretty similar to the one you already posted twice in this thread: he said his email stated he loved the guitar, it was the best he'd tried and couldn't imagine anything better. He'd only played a Fernandez with a broken neck that someone fixed with wood-glue, plugged into a 25w Fender Frontman - it was the best guitar he'd played. However, he started having problems with his RiM-jibber Olson guitar and he could tell the guys at the guitar shop were not impressed by the craftsmanship - apparently it took two weeks and $100 out of this kids pocket to get it into 'playable' condition. He said he tried out a few more guitars at the music shop and his gut sank - he felt really ripped off and thats when he called me, to get the opinion of another Phish fan guitar player. I let him try my Artinger and he was completely blown away. When I tried the Ollandic, the guitar sounded completely dead - no resonance or liveliness. The neck was completely wonky - twisted so at the nut the high-e string was half a centimeter lower than the low-e string. The intonation was, not surprisingly given the neck, way off - I adjusted the intonation at the bridge and it improved somewhat. Also, the bridge was not grounded - if it ever had been, the soldering hadn't held up the past couple months (I tested the grounding with a multimeter from the bridge to the jack), so the guitar buzzed quite a bit with any dirt pedals. The pickups were also way out of position - one was too low, the other too high and I have to imagine a set of SD 59's would have been an improvement. And visually, the craftsmanship is just not there - the neck joint was messy with bubbles from the glue and/or finish, the fretwork was sloppy and I had to file a handful of them for this kid, the binding was uneven along the edge of the body sticking up past the wood, I could spot dust in the finish in several places.

The kid wanted a working-musicians guitar and figured it would be cool to have one that also looked like Trey's. Now he wasted two summers' earnings on a POS toy that is actually unplayable IMO: he's gone back to his Fernandez with a broken neck for the last three weeks. He feels pretty embarrassed and angry and asked me not to disclose any other personal details about him or the specifics of his guitar (such as the type of wood or when exactly he placed the order) - he doesn't want to think about it anymore. I told him if he helped me sell some of my stuff on Craigslist, he could keep some of the cash and I'd help him get a better guitar (he's interested in something like and SG), or I'd at least help him replace the neck on his Fernandez. He won't sell his Olson guitar because he doesn't think it would be morally right.

Olson, your not providing a service to these people, your ripping people off who don't know any better. The guitars I built in my parent's basement right after college free-handing with a jigsaw and router (the only two powered tools I had) played better - I sold one of them for the cost of parts ($140) and thought that was a fair price. I'd rather have a Cort, Rondo, Washburn or any of those other few-hundred-$ hollowbody guitars than the Olson - much more bang for buck because they actually play and your not just paying for a cheap look-alike built by a guy who is clearly being untruthful to himself and others.

Your not even a good story teller... because your phoney story is full of holes.  Like spending a two weeks and $100.00 for a luthier to get it into playable condition and then you find one pickup high and one pickup low. Then you give this line how you tried it and its all of a sudden dead with a twisted neck..   Like other members of this forum have told me about you... your just full of bull...  And then how you built guitars... do you forget your own thread about how you were putting in new pickups and screwed them all up?

This thread has been great for me... new sales new inquiries. 

People are not fooled by you guys... forum members  have told me how they see right through your and Posters bull. Or as Happyorange27 called him
the great Posternutbag!

[Poster]

 Its all a conspiracy! Your weird ass copied fake emails from "new sales" are far out man. You need therapy. Maybe you should have your chinese guitars made in korea, that way you can call it the Kolondoc?   If you don't like the fact people dont like your guitars, your in the wrong fucking industry dude. If there is anything on the planet that people are finicky about its guitars. So yeah, your guitars are chinese made pieces of shit. If you buy one, hope you know a good luthier to set um up, and plenty of cash lying around to polish your chinese guitar.

ITS A TROLL!